When reading the book Class: A Guide Through The American Status System, I would have to agree with Bridget, I would be lying if I sat here and blogged about how wonderful this book was. I had a hard time reading it, but the author Fussel, did make some interesting points. One of my favorite points he made in the book is when he said "Actually, you reveal a great deal about your social class by the amount of annoyance or fury you feel when the subject is brought up." I never even thought about it that way. It would have never crossed my mind that peoples actions and the way they respond to the matter can detect what social class you are from. For example, in the book, he said that the upper class people love talking about it, they love the attention that they receive. It makes complete sense to me, that some upper class people present themselves in a way, so that you know they are upper class, nothing less. Whereas the lower class people are upset and furious when talking about social status. I just really thought this was interesting and I'm wondering now that I'm aware of this, If I will notice peoples reactions.
Of course money is a way to define what social class you are. I think we all know this and we are all aware of the way some people present themselves when they have a lot of money. It is sad to think that our society is solely based on money, especially when our economy is struggling. Fussel also states that "in the middle, people grant that money has something to do with it, but think education and the kind of work you do almost equally important".I would have to agree with this statement, maybe because I would classify myself in the middle class. I am lucky enough that my parents could afford to send me to college and pay for my education, so I can be successful and make a living for myself and one day my family. I have heard the saying: "just get the piece of paper ( a degree) and you'll be fine". Is this really true considering todays economy? How many college graduates are graduated and still don't have a job?
Another thing I want to comment on is when a Boston blue collar man is talking about when he thinks of a really rich man he thinks about the estates and the house that you can't see from the road. Fussel calls this " the class in hiding". They like to be the house away from the street or on the islands. In a way, how can you fault them? I can see why this can be considered as " the class in hiding" but in a way, they seem to be minding their own business. How can you fault them? Who are we to judge if they have worked hard and have deserved there estates?
I'm sure each of us think of social class in different ways and probably interpreted this book in many ways. I think we think that we understand social class because of how were we were raised and what social class we were born into. Will we ever truly understand each meaning of each social class? Probably not and I think that is OK. A quote I want to leave you with is another one by our Author, Fussel: ..." It is very difficult to escape, culturally, from the class into which you have been born" What do you think?
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Emily I also found when the author was talking about people revealing their social class by how much they talk about it interesting. I am sure we have both witnessed this very thing, but never really took it into consideration. I know I have heard people brag or go on about what they have but I always looked at it as a way they are trying to be accepted or liked. I really did not think about it as they are showing what social class they are in. Maybe the people in lower class that are upset when talking about social status get upset because they feel that it is not accepted or they should be ashamed of it.
ReplyDeleteYour second paragraph I agree with 100%. When Fussell talks about education and work being equally as important I think he is right considering how things are currently. It seems that if you do not have "the piece of paper" there is no hope in getting a good job. I also think that more and more education is going to be required. I feel that getting a college degree nowadays is equivalent to a high school degree. A college degree is just a must have for any company and now more and more companies are requiring a masters. Soon I feel a masters will be the education you need to get a good job not just a college degree. So when the author says education is just as important as money and social class I really do feel that he has a very valid point.
I think to a certain degree it is a little more difficult to escape from the class we are brought into, but it is not impossible if people really want it.
Class warfare has been used for well over a century in American politics. It seems like many, including Fussel, seem to believe that redistributing wealth would be a quick fix to perceived social ills. There have been many different weapons used in the class warfare; labor unions, death taxes, entitlement programs… the list could go on and on.
ReplyDelete“Social injustice” would be eliminated if everybody worked hard to improve their own status as well as do what they could, individually, to help our neighbors.
to start off, your last statement chris will never happen... sadly enough, it's a great dream but it's just not human nature for us to help out everyone else. most of our policies are everyone fends for them self, and it's the survival of the fittest. it's like Dawkins Fittest gene, the best genes will weed out the weakest. there are a few people that do help out, and that's great, but there will never be a time where everyone will go all liberal and start helping everyone else.
ReplyDeletei do agree with you emily about how education is very pertinent to social class, and your education can help determine your career. which the career will also affect what social class people will view you in. in today growing society it is harder to get decent jobs without a degree, heck i was looking at jobs a few summers ago and most of them required that you had a degree. They didn't care what degree you obtained as long as you have that $40,000 piece of paper that says you've done something. you've now experienced 4+ years of "higher learning," however obscure it might be, and now you're ready for the world... though i am reminded of an interview on the colbert report that he conducted of an author, whom i forget his name, who believed that people should just skip college, and that in highschool instead of learning our classic school curricular we should be taught business ethics and how to network. his reasoning was that college builds up an unbearable about debt, and in that time if a young person just knew how to network and had a business sense, instead of being in debt and looking for a job, they could already have started a business and flourished. made sense, and for some people it worked. i mean heck, some of the billionaires that are out there never even graduated. look at bill gates, left Harvard his junior year according to this biography (http://www.woopidoo.com/biography/bill-gates.htm). maybe if we just learn how to operate a business we might be alright...
I wanted to be the first to get here so I could comment about the declining value of a college degree, but Alex beat me to it. It's become (a bachelor's degree) more and more like a high school diploma nowadays -- my fiance works for the library, making 9.65 an hour (plus benefits). She's now planning to go for a graduate degree. When I graduate, I'll probably still be in food service until I can earn a Masters, unless I get lucky and find a better job. While acknowledging the high unemployment rate and the current state of the economy, to me, this serves as evidence for the point that education is a strong indication of social education. It should probably be noted that this indication goes hand in hand with the level of education you complete. To wit, a family with four kids and an income of $25,000 a year can educate all four kids right through a collegiate degree, all on public funds. If I understood the bill correctly, there was a rider on the health bill passed in the House on Sunday that granted an additional $45 billion or thereabouts for Pell grants and student loan reform.
ReplyDeleteWhat happens when a Masters is required to get a white-collar job? Maybe education is a strong indicator of class now, but in the future? And what sort of effect would a better-educated population have on class?
Just to respond quickly to Christopher's comment, I agree with the sentiment that people will better themselves if they try, I think the sub-prime mortgage crisis sort of showed us that, no matter how hard you work, sometimes other peoples' actions can determine your reality more than your own. For a lot of people, the idea of helping your neighbor while working to better your status is a contradiction.
Oh, and as far as the "unseen" class goes -- that's how I would want to live if I were filthy, stinking rich. Just saying.
Fussell most likely knew what he was setting himself up for when he decided to write this book on social class. No one is going to agree on what he has to say, because we all view it differently. Some parts of the book were so ridiculous that I found it a little amusing. However there are great points he makes only about a few things:
ReplyDeleteHe is right when he talks about revealing what class you are in. If a person is annoyed or furious about the subject it is obvious that they are insecure and they are middle class. Fussell also adds that the more people talk about class issues the better the upper class seems to be or look. I never thought that the rich even cared about talking about class or cared much of others outside their own class.
Fussell wrote that anyone who shows anxiety towards the subject is middle class and are nervous about slipping down a rung or two. I particularly disagree with that statement, it may just be people in the middle class want to be higher in social class and they are a little jealous of the upper class.
In Chapter Three (Appearance Counts) he says that good-looking people marry up and the insecure and ugly tend to marry down. I found this statement to be amusing only because I believe you often match your looks with the person you marry no matter what class you are in. Lets face it there are ugly, insecure, and good-looking people in every class.
I agree with what this “class in hiding” and they way they seclude themselves from others. If they don’t want to build their house by the road, on top of the hill in the middle of the woods or way out on an island then I say go for it! Personally it would be too lonely for me but if you want to be left alone then that’s your business.
Emily,
ReplyDelete"In the middle, people grant that money has something to do with it, but think education and the kind of work you do almost equally important." I also completely agree with this statement. I tend to think that money, upbringing, and privelige have a bit more to do with it than the kind of work you do - or - money, upbringing, and privelige decide what kind of work you do most of the time.
The point about class revealing itself when discussions of social class come about also seems very true! I can admit that I'm middle class, and it is infuriating sometimes to see other members of middle or lower classes looked down upon by members of higher classes!
Also the rich separating themselves from others, I can understand why they do that. I think that part of it is for exclusivity, and the other part is for privacy.
Absolutely! I think that it is very difficult if not impossible to escape, culturally, form the class into which you were born. Your cultural is your roots, it is a piece of your identity, your make-up, and it’s embedded in your DNA. You know it just goes back to my example about the roots of apple tree. If you dig cut the roots off then the tree is dead. You can’t just add new roots to the tree. Culturally I am lower class, because my parents are lower-class and their parents were lower class and so on so on…..I cannot change that, but I can change the direction of my future. By the grace of God I have been granted the opportunity to up root and relocate myself with all of my cultural heritage i.e roots, to an environment that is conducive for quality growth, hence, NKU; gaining a education. Me, and all of my roots are planted it in a soil that is richer, the soil represents the class; where the conditions of the land are of quality so that I can produce good fruit. The fruit that I produce, every decision I make, is always going to affect my culture no matter what, because I cannot change the roots. I cannot change the roots, but I can determine the quality of the fruit.
ReplyDeleteI read on the People Like Us website last week something that Fussell had written which seemed to stand out and made me think of when I read Emily’s blog.
ReplyDelete-When, recently, asked what I am writing, I have answered, "A book about social class in America," people tend first to straighten their ties and sneak a glance at their cuffs to see how far fraying has advanced there. Then, a few minutes later, they silently get up and walk away. It is not just that I am feared as a class spy. It is as if I had said, "I am working on a book urging the beating to death of baby whales using the dead bodies of baby seals."
To me that not only proves that social class isn’t something that most people think about in their day to day lives, but it is also something that most everyone in America fears discussing. No one WANTS to be viewed as poor or not as good as everyone else, but the appearance and standards that the society of America has set upon this country seem to make the majority of its citizen’s feel inadequate.
When Fussell brings up the fact that you reveal a great deal about your social class by the amount of annoyance or fury you feel when the subject is brought up made so much sense. The upper-class people love to topic to come up: the more attention paid to the matter the better off they seem to be. To me this is completely ironic, those who have the “goods to flaunt” the social class they are a part of still feel the need to discuss this with anyone they come in contact with. I could NEVER imagine and hope I NEVER experience the limitation of or have to resort to discussing any of the following topics at any social gather I attend in my lifetime: my wealth, my job, my car, my house or my travels.
With the middle class a tendency to get very anxious suggests that you are nervous about slipping down a rung or two. This makes complete sense too because looking at everything Fussell said, those in the middle class are worried about what those in social classes above them view them as while at the same time criticize those citizens in the classes below them.
Emily, I do agree with Fussell in that it is very difficult to escape, culturally, from the class into which you have been born. If one doesn’t continue to achieve the life of the social class he or she was born into, I feel they will do anything in their power to convey to those around them that they still belong. And should they ever surpass the social status they grew up having, the will quickly adapt to the attitude of being better than those who are considered lower in social class. Not ever realizing that they are bickering and gossiping about the people they were once associated with.
I completely agree with everyone’s comments about education. This is my 6th year taking classes (with a few semesters off here and there) and I remember going into college it was, get it and out in four years! Just get your diploma and you will have no problem finding a job. Now that I am about to graduate, I continuously get questions. What’s next? Where are you going to work? Are you going to get your Masters? I feel the last question is in there because it has now become a social standard, which in turn, has its major downfall because of the economy and job market these days. Although having your masters may make you more qualified I know many teacher positions today are being filled by only those who have their undergraduate degree in teaching because the school systems will not have to pay them as much as someone who has their masters. So does this mean because of the economic crisis that those in the middle class, no matter how you define classes (money, education, beliefs) are gaining the upper hand?
Emily,
ReplyDeleteThank you for highlighting a few of the more interesting passages from Fussell's book (from the intro and p. 169). I, too, found the following passage enlightening:
"If you reveal your class by your outrage at the very topic, you reveal it also by the way you define the thing that's outraging you. At the bottom, people tend to believe that class is defined by the amount of money you have. In the middle, people grant that money has something to do with it, but think education and the kind of work you do almost equally important. Nearer the top, people perceive that taste, values, ideas, style, and behavior are indispensable criteria of class, regardless of money or occupation or education" (16).
I think this statement is profound, even elegant. One problem with studying class is that the object of investigation (social class) changes with the social class of the observer. Let's call this the parallax of class. Just because class is parallactic, however, doesn't mean "it's all relative." There is a reality to class, and Fussell's often tongue-in-cheek taxonomy is one possible approach to getting at this reality. As IST majors, I'm sure you have plenty of other disciplinary tools to use to unearth the reality of class as well.
Emily also mentions the phenomenon of "class in hiding": "How can you fault them? Who are we to judge if they have worked hard and have deserved there estates?" To play provocateur (a pedagogical role if there ever was one): Does the "top out-of-sight" class deserve its estates? Emily says if they worked hard they do, but isn't this rather the exception than the rule? Estates are inherited (the good ol' genetic lottery). Do children deserve their parents' fortunes, which are probably generations in the making? Andrew Carnegie, the great steel magnate (and hardly a socialist), didn't think they did. In fact, he thought an inheritance would hurt his children by stripping them of the motivation to lead meaningful lives. His "gospel of wealth" philosophy led him to bequeath his mass fortunes for public purposes (almost every other building in Pittsburgh, my hometown, is named after him: Carnegie Museum, Carnegie Mellon University, Carnegie Hall, Carnegie Library, etc.).
I mean, they call all income that is not a wage "unearned income" for a reason, right? Perhaps they live in hiding because they know, on some unconscious level, that they don't deserve to be rich?
Thanks for the comments everyone! Here is an interesting article I found today on my MSN homepage:
ReplyDeletehttp://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Investing/Extra/are-you-middle-class.aspx?GT1=33002